Friendship and Recovery: Lisa Dare's Story on Supporting Sobriety with Loved Ones

Have you ever witnessed a friend or family member suffer from alcoholism or addiction and wondered how you could help?

Join us as we share Lisa Dare's powerful journey of witnessing a friend's descent into alcoholism and supporting her path to recovery. Lisa's experiences at a work event sparked a realization that led to her friend's crucial decision to seek help. Through her touching narrative, Lisa and I discuss the stigma and workplace gossip surrounding addiction, and the pivotal role of understanding it as a disease.

In our conversation, we explore the importance of a non-judgmental support system in battling alcoholism/addiction. We dive into the emotional toll addiction takes on families, particularly the harsh realities faced by mothers at risk of losing their children. Lisa's story is an example of the importance of open communication about addiction and celebrates the recovery that is possible from dedicated support and love.

As we talk about the transformative journey of her friend's sobriety, Lisa shares insights on building a resilient life through therapy, coaching, and a strong support foundation. We highlight the importance of personal leadership and the courage to ask for help. Lisa discusses the roles of therapy for healing past wounds and coaching for personal growth.

Listen to understand how trauma-informed coaching can empower individuals to live healthier, happier lives.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

Watching a loved one, a family member or friend struggle with active alcoholism or addiction can be heartbreaking. The disease of addiction often brings disappointment, sadness and destroyed relationships. Meet Lisa as she talks from an outside perspective, not as someone who suffered from addiction herself, but as someone who watched a very close friend endure and ultimately recover from alcoholism. Today she's going to share her story of how she supported her friend through that recovery process. Welcome to the Sober Living Stories podcast. This podcast is dedicated to sharing stories of sobriety. We shine a spotlight on individuals who have faced the challenges of alcoholism and addiction and are today living out their best lives sober. Each guest has experienced incredible transformation and are here to share their story with you. I'm Jessica Stepanovic, your host. Join me each week as guests from all walks of life share their stories to inspire and provide hope to those who need it most.

Speaker 1: 1:26

Welcome to another episode of the Sober Living Stories podcast. Meet Lisa Dare. She's going to share her powerful experience with a close friend's journey through alcoholism and recovery. Listen in to understand what it's like to witness someone battle addiction and how it affects their loved ones. Lisa is going to also offer valuable insight on how you can support others through the recovery and what you can watch out for. With both her personal and professional insights as a coach, lisa is versed in helping others become the best version of themselves and reach their full potential. Hi and welcome to the show, lisa. Hello, jessica, it's great to have you on. I love giving listeners an outside perspective on what it looks like to witness someone go through addiction and then come out of it, and so I'm really interested in hearing your insight. If you want to just kind of start from whatever point you'd like to and bring us through to the present day, yes, I'd be, I'd be happy to do that.

Speaker 2: 2:34

So the I have a very close friend and it was actually somebody that I met through work, so we had we've been friends now for over 20 years. So it's hard to believe and I think you know what struck me when I saw your um, the topic of your podcast, jessica, was, yes, you know it's. I think you know, often we think about the um, the impact on the individual, but, as you said, there's um a lot of impacts, just in many different ways. And I think, having been through this experience with my friend of her battling alcoholism, I learned so much about it because I think as an everyday person, you sort of hear about it, you know about A and A, but you don't know a lot about it until you truly experience it. And it's interesting because my original background was as a healthcare professional, so I also saw it from that lens as well people who were being treated for acute episodes of alcohol poisoning and things like that. But what happened for me with my friend was what I discovered, jessica and I know it's been documented is that she was somebody who hit it really well and I can remember the episode that sort of became, I guess, the tipping point to me, sort of discovering that maybe something was really wrong.

Speaker 2: 4:01

And this happened to be at work, at a work function. I'm in the pharmacy, I was in the pharmaceutical industry. It happened to be a function where we were hosting an educational event with some physicians and at the end of the evening I noticed that my friend had actually gotten quite intoxicated and in fact the staff at the restaurant had come over because she and another physician had really indulged quite a bit. And they were concerned because where I am in Canada, there's laws now around establishments like bars and restaurants in terms of not serving somebody if they see that they're clearly intoxicated and could present harm to themselves or others. And so the staff came over and they said well, we're a little bit concerned. We know this is your co-work, we know these are your clients. What would you like us to do? Because we obviously can't serve them anymore? And unfortunately, what had happened was, with my other colleague, we were trying to figure out what to do and both of them ended up leaving in one vehicle and it was just kind of shocking to me. I just didn't know what to do. I had not come across this before and what ended up happening was I discovered the story afterwards was that, yes, she had left with this physician. I'm not sure what happened that evening. She was married and I think that was just the start for me of Jessica, of then reflecting back on some other incidences that had happened where I noticed that she had consumed a lot of alcohol and seemed to actually be fairly intoxicated, like it just sort of started to trigger for me some things of like I wonder what's going on. And unfortunately, that particular episode, jessica, some of the other physicians that were there were concerned and it got reported to my manager and that was actually the turning point of when she actually sought professional help. So at that point she was advised by our employer that she needed to actually seek professional help and that she would need treatment. So she did actually go to a treatment facility.

Speaker 2: 6:26

One of the things that I would share is that what I thought was unfortunate, jessica, in the situation, was the gossip that ensued. Right there, I think again, right, it's the stigma, it's the people wanting to gossip about it and making things up about this individual, when I, when, you know, I realized it is a disease, you know, and she actually had a family history of her father having been an alcoholic in a similar in the in the same industry. So you know there's also that aspect of I know possibly that being genetic or hereditary or certainly having been exposed to it as a family member, how that can influence somebody as well. So during the time that she was in treatment it was meant to be kept confidential at work I was actually one of the very few people that knew but it got disclosed to other people and I was actually really disappointed and upset that that had happened. She subsequently left the organization. She was, unfortunately I don't recall now whether she chose to leave or she was exited, but she left the organization and a couple of us as friends, as very close friends with her, were supporting her.

Speaker 2: 7:46

And one of the very unfortunate things that happened, jessica, was that she lost custody of her daughter. Her husband actually filed for separation and filed for custody of her daughter. Her daughter was, I think, about eight or nine at the time for custody of her daughter. Her daughter was, I think, about eight or nine at the time. She was living, you know, alone in an apartment trying to make ends meet with a cleaning job she did at one point try to take her own life by overdosing on medication, but I think it was more just a cry for help than it was truly wanting to end, so to speak. But one of our another mutual friend of ours actually took her in for a period of time to just give her a place to sort of land and support her while she was getting back on her feet.

Speaker 2: 8:43

And I think the thing that I learned from that, jessica, is how important it is to really just be there as a support, not to judge, to educate, to educate ourselves on learning more about alcoholism and addiction, to understand and to really appreciate the kinds of issues that they might be struggling with. I think for her, the thing that I did the most, jessica, was just to listen, to just be there, to truly make myself available, to say if you do need to reach out, please reach out. And she did also share some concerns with her children. She eventually got custody of her daughter back, but it was a number of years and, of course, by the time that happened, her daughter was moving into the tween years, which is a sort of a very challenging time of life for parents and the kids going through it and one of the biggest concerns that her daughter had and her daughter is a very bright young woman is, she said could I possibly go down the same road? Her alcoholism also caused her to be separated from her oldest son, who she has not had contact with for many, many years now. She did have to do work to repair her relationship with her middle son as well.

Speaker 2: 10:13

So I see somebody who has really fought to come back from something and to um, to really battle the stigma, um, the judgment, the shame, um and um also be willing to admit her mistakes. Um, that was, you know, that was something she said she spent a lot of time with her kids talking about was just owning her mistakes. Uh, and I know that that's also part of the process through AA. She's been, I think, about 15 years sober now. Yeah, and one of the things I think post post her recovery, jessica, that I'm very mindful of is in social events, just kind of checking in on her to say, are you okay with being at this event? Because it's, you know there's probably going to be, you know, a lot of alcohol served right, or there's going to be bar service, or if we go for dinner, I will, I specifically bring alcohol, free wine, and we all drink it, right, because I'm perfectly fine with doing that.

Speaker 1: 11:28

Yeah, you've touched on so many good points so we can just pause here for a second and just touch on a couple of them. So, first of all, like I think from the very beginning, when you said we had talked pre-recording, about how women have the ability to two things one, hide it, you know, because of the stigma, and two, like it, it takes them. So. So a lot of women are affected differently. So you know, I know someone who started drinking when they were like in their fort and by the time they were 45, it was just a mess. So it affects women differently and you talked a lot about and that's true, we can present and we're high functioning and we get up and we go to work.

Speaker 1: 12:20

I talk about a lot how an act of alcoholism you get up and you, you head to work when you should probably be heading to, like, the hospital, you know. And the other thing is that, it being a disease, I know for myself I didn't understand that, like I didn't, you know, I didn't understand that it was my mom that said to me. She said if you had cancer, we would all be surrounding your bedside. This is no different. This is a disease. You're going to take care of it, and then you're going to get better and you're going to move on. And that really helped me.

Speaker 1: 12:52

And she was also, like you had mentioned, the one that in my early years I would be at like a long dinner table but she would always order exactly what I ordered. You get like a Perrier, or you get a Coke or table, but she would always order what? Exactly what I ordered. You know, you get like a Perrier or you get a Coke or something, and she would have exactly what I had and I knew that. So she was like just such a a solid ground for me, you know, and it's just so important to have people who aren't judging, who are accepting and who are trying to understand what you're going through, to see, see you back to your normal self.

Speaker 2: 13:26

So yeah, yeah, and I think that piece, jessica, around the fact that women do tend to present as more high functioning is a really important piece, especially now in a world that is so chaotic piece.

Speaker 2: 13:47

Especially now in a world that is so chaotic, a world right where people wear that badge of busyness, right, like I'm so busy I don't have time to write, like have coffee with you, right, or like, and I think that just adds an extra layer of pressure right to people and what you know and how they deal with that.

Speaker 2: 14:03

And so I think also just being much more accepting and normalizing the importance of mental health as much as physical health. And I think, to your piece, as you said, around, you know, if it was cancer, right, we would all be rallying because you know there's all this, you know so much around cancer. But I think that was also a really important point in her recovery is to know that she had people behind her that supported her right and yes, even if I didn't understand it, not to judge it right, because I have no idea what it would be like to be in that world. Right To, as you said, right to get up in the morning and, yeah, you know, have a drink and go to work right and put on your face right. So we've just got to really be there to just have their back right and then have them know that we will be there no matter what.

Speaker 1: 15:05

Yeah, and also when you made the point that she almost came to the point of not wanting to be here anymore.

Speaker 1: 15:13

And so you take a relatively highly functioning individual, pair it with the disease of alcoholism and the struggle to live in that becomes so difficult that that looks like a good option.

Speaker 1: 15:30

And and you know, and that is time and time again, you know, I've heard people and I've experienced that myself and it's and it's mind blowing in retrospect, but so very true and that kind of speaks to the difficulty of this disease and how it can really take someone out not only of their day-to-day life, out of their children's life, but out of life itself, you know. And so the seriousness of it is there and my heart goes out to any woman, mom, who has their children taken as a result of, because I've seen that time and again and I had one particular friend who the same thing happened and the support was so big. I remember sitting in court the day that happened and she had asked a couple people to show up and I think there was 15 women there to support her regaining custody of her son because she had been in a better place for so long and they did award her that that day. But it didn't come easy. That's really a matter of your heart. That's one of the heartbreaking realities of addiction.

Speaker 2: 16:50

And I think the other thing that I would add to that, jessica, is that you know this story does have a positive ending. You know she divorced her husband at that time, you know, found somebody else that she's been married to for over 10 years now I was actually her maid of honor. She's repaired the relationship with her daughter and her son and I think sometimes too, jessica, when somebody goes through something like this, they worry about the impact on their children, right, particularly when they talk about a hereditary or genetic component to it. She's had very, very open conversations with her daughter around that right, if you, you know, particularly when she's going to you. You know, particularly when she's going to university.

Speaker 2: 17:35

You know, if you we don't know a lot about, you know, like, whether you'll be affected the same way as me. It's. It's up to you the choices you want to make, but come to me, talk to me, ask me any questions. So she's always been a very open book and I think that has really helped because both of her children that she does have relationships with are very successful. You know her daughter's an accountant, her son is an electrician, right, and he started his own family. So there's a really great happy ending to that story. But yes to your point, it can take some time, as it did, for her to actually regain custody of her daughter over time.

Speaker 1: 18:16

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Speaker 1: 19:14

Now back to our guest. I agree with you too. That is the story of being in the disease but once out of it, the promises of restoration of your family, reconciliation with friendships, regaining yourself professionally all of those just as hot. You know we were talking about high functioning and you know that high functioning alcoholic once the alcohol is removed, they are just a complete success story. You know, and and to to the point of the kids. I think that that experience, yeah, it's that genetic component. You know, you never know right. So those conversations you're able to be a little bit more candid, having lived through it yourself, and you're able to give your kids an edge on because you know like the world is. You know, just covered in alcohol, drugs, I don't know vaping, whatever anybody's doing in the middle school, high school level, that kind of kicks off. You know what their trajectory is going to be and to have that wisdom before they walk in the door or walk in that classroom, to know is so important.

Speaker 2: 20:31

Well, it was interesting to Jessica because we would often have conversations around what it was interesting to Jessica because we would often have conversations around what it was like for her to be at events, um, sober, um, and how you know, she said it was a very different experience.

Speaker 2: 20:46

Um, my husband and I actually don't drink very much by choice. That's just who we are, um, and it is interesting, right, it's just who we are and it is interesting, right, it's just like, okay, the conversations that you're having, the behaviors that you're noticing, right, but it's challenging, right, and I know that there's more awareness and more encouragement to people to live a consciously sober life. But, you're right, because it's, those kinds of vices and activities are often associated with what we see as being fun, right, it's like, and you know, and really, what is the term? And and really what is the term social drinker mean like you either drink or you don't. It's like there's nothing social about it. It's almost like if you're social, you're it. It's almost like if you're social, you're okay. But it's just like if you went past that point, you become an alcoholic. And it's like, well, actually, social drinkers probably have an alcohol problem.

Speaker 1: 21:46

Yeah, yeah, you can really get back into the world. You know, once you have a really strong foundation and you do have the support of friends like yourself, and then also family, who is and I think that really comes after that internal decision is made from the alcoholic or the addict that they don't want to do this anymore and they're committed to wellness. You know, and once they respect you know, I know, once I respected my own sobriety, I knew that I would never have to explain it to anyone else again. It just I knew that I had crossed over into a life that I wanted to live and I was willing to do anything to stay there, and that really changed my relation. They always say you know, if you've ever heard this saying, um, the people closest to us are the last ones to see us change right, and so it's a walk, but it's one worth taking right Because you can live in this world today sober.

Speaker 1: 22:45

The stigma is still there, for sure, but just like with anything else that holds a stigma, it takes years and I think presently I feel like it's a lot more accepted, there's a lot more non-alcoholic whatever coming up, and once you arrest alcoholism, it doesn't have to become your entire life to be like sobriety, like a sober person, you get access to all the other parts of your life that you were cutting out when you were drinking. So your life really gets big, whereas in active addiction, you know it's small, and so there's that component too. It's really a positive, a positive to a sober life. If you're truly afflicted with alcoholism, you're truly afflicted with alcoholism.

Speaker 2: 23:34

I really love that metaphor, Jessica, of how you actually get bigger rather than smaller. It's like widening the aperture when you're actually in a place where you can actually have clarity and really be present. And the other thing that you touched on that I just wanted to mention was that as part of her journey, she did embrace working with a therapist, and I did have the opportunity to work with her as a coach. So I think that's the other thing that I would share with people is that asking for help right, and we hear it a lot, but asking for help is a sign of strength.

Speaker 1: 24:36

Asking for help, right, and we hear it a lot, but asking for help is a sign of strength, not weakness, right, Because it takes courage and strength to say I have an issue that needs support or help or assistance right Of some sort. And so I think for her, that was also a really important part of her journey, of which, you know, I applaud her for because it takes a village. Yeah, sure, sure. So what are some of the things that you know? When you were talking, before we started, you had said you had noticed some signs. We'll go here first before we go to the solution part of it that we hide it, right, so people hide it. And so what are some of the signs I could think back of? When we would be at a family event and everybody else would drink while they were there, but then, as they were walking out, the drink would be over and they would be saying their goodbyes. And I remember always having something still in my hand.

Speaker 1: 25:18

And I'm like wow, you know in retrospect telltale sign. You know, like, if you can't put it down or remove yourself from it, you know like that it was just different. It was different than what everybody else was doing. Did you see any telltale signs in addition to what you've already spoken about?

Speaker 2: 25:39

Yeah, that's a good question. That's a good question. So during the time that we worked together, one of the things that would happen is, if we were on at meetings, we would actually have, of course, our business meeting, but we would also have social events. And I think if I were to reflect back there's, you know, I didn't really pay attention to it, but if I reflect back, there seemed to be quite a bit of consumption of alcohol, right, it wasn't just the one or two right Drinks, there seemed to be a lot.

Speaker 2: 26:19

And she would often, on occasion, she would get into very sort of depressive moods, right, because I think you know again, I know from my days in university, when you know everybody drank, they would party, like you would get some people who would get very depressed, right, some people who just talked a lot, right, she was one of these people who would get quite depressed. And so, as I think about that Jessica, which is not really like her, she's a very practical, no nonsense person, person. It's not to say that she isn't emotional or caring, but she just wasn't those people. That was that emotive, but it it happened when she would drink right. And then I do recall now references to things growing up that were hard. She had a you know she loved her dad and she had a very close relationship with her dad, but she would also allude to just family issues that existed. So again, I think to me as I reflect back, those might be some of the sort of telltale signs. And then certainly that episode that became the turning point was a real sort of eye opener, I think, of like some very dramatic behavior that I had not ever seen before.

Speaker 1: 27:37

Right, right, yeah, you mentioned you know family and upbringing and to you know, like alcohol, I think for so many people is like a coping mechanism, and so when you put it down, I think you're saying about a therapist whatever their road to recovery is, whether they use a 12 step or they, however they they come to build a foundation. I think added therapy is so key, like it's such an addition to understanding yourself, um, bringing to light those things that may have been hard, like talking about those struggles, so that it becomes less and you don't have all this to cope with because your coping mechanism as you once knew it is now gone. And to then get some tools on how to better cope, because life doesn't stop In sobriety. We have losses, we have sicknesses, job changes, moves, difficulties that you have to navigate, sober, and so if you reach out early and I think you know asking for help, you know a lot of times the inability to ask for help just delays recovery for years, you know.

Speaker 1: 28:48

And so self-sufficient people like suffer for that because they're like I can do this. Why can't you know why? Why is this failing? Why? You know for me, you know how can I not solve this, you know and it just that drive to just figure it out just takes years away from you know, truly getting help, and finally you're just like I need help, like I really need help, and that's when things started to change, I know, for me.

Speaker 2: 29:17

Well, and I think you make a really good point, jessica, which is what are the things that we can do to sustain that? Right, what sort of? Because, right, the temptation doesn't go away. Right, because, unfortunately you can't. You know, you hope that the people around you will be supportive, like I said, you know I am very mindful to bring a de-alcoholized wine, which I know she enjoys when we go for dinner, to their house, but, you know, unfortunately people can't remove themselves from alcohol completely in the environment.

Speaker 2: 29:50

Um, and so it is about what sort of, as you said, tools and skills, and and even for all of us, right, because, again, right, we just, the world continues to be more challenging. We're all being hit with different traumas all the time. Right, you and I talked about the fact that we care for parents. Right, that in and of itself creates pressure. Right, just, our life circumstances.

Speaker 2: 30:15

So, I love what you said, and one of the things that I've educated myself on is resilience, because I see that is something that really even just clients who are not struggling with an addiction, but maybe workaholics, is a form of addiction. Right, because they are constantly checking their phone. Right, they are on email on the weekends. Right, they're working late at phone, right. They are on email on the weekends, right. They're working late at night, right. And so it's the to your point how do we build resilience, right, and how do we learn the tools that will help us in those moments, as you said, where that stress and that tension comes right, where you're looking for some way to really manage it effectively?

Speaker 1: 31:01

Right, right, yeah, so here would be a great place to, because I know you have this personal experience with a friend who suffered from this and now is living out an incredible life without it. So you have that personal experience, but you also have a professional experience, because you do coach others to find their best version of themselves and live to their full potential. So can you talk a little bit about what you offer and where people can connect with you? You know we'd like to add that at the end where people can connect with you if they wanted to, because if this resonates with them you've had this experience then you would be the one to speak on that, you know, so share with listeners, just from a professional perspective.

Speaker 2: 31:53

Absolutely so. One of the things that I would want to share with your listeners, jessica, is to know that, as we talked about the value of a therapist and I love what you said which is that it actually, if we the sooner we do it, it actually allows us to move towards recovery more quicker, and so coaching is really one of those things that can be very effective as a, as a complimentary approach. So therapy will help individuals resolve some of the, as you said, issues and challenges, particularly past ones, that people may be struggling with, and coaching is really very much a forward focused modality right. So, now that you we've got you working on these issues, you know, if I take my friend's example, you know, with your dad and his addiction, let's talk about where you want to go with your life. Now that you know we've got you working on these issues, you know, if I take my friend's example, you know, with your dad and his addiction, let's talk about where you want to go with your life. Now that you know you've got you know a way forward. So I would work with individuals to help them identify their values. Are they living in alignment with their values? If they're not, you know what? What, what can I do to help them with that? And what I love about coaching is it's all about empowering the individual to make choices that align with who they are and connect to what they value, and it is less about them not being capable but the fact that they are capable and that really, as a coach, I work alongside them to really identify what's most important to them and, I think, to your, what we've been talking about, jessica.

Speaker 2: 33:29

The first step to anything is recognizing and acknowledging I have an issue right, I have a disease, I have this behavior right, I have these habits right, that awareness and the acknowledgement and the ownership of them, but also the desire and the commitment to making changes that will create much more positive movement in their life. So I do that through coaching sessions, but I also bring a lot of different tools, assessments, and I also draw from so many bodies of knowledge. I you know I mentioned to you in the our email correspondence that I'm working at training in a program where it's coaching with a trauma informed lens, and I think that's actually really important, jessica, because particularly for people in addiction often not all, but often many of them have suffered some type of trauma right. When you speak about the coping mechanism, right, and that's what's happened to many addicts, right, they're trying to make the pain that they're suffering go away because they don't know how to do it, and so being able to understand that as a coach, and to support people with an approach that will help them, I believe, is really important. So I'm bringing that to my practice, and I'm also very much about creating personal leadership. We are all leaders, and you decided to take charge of your life, right, you decided to make some decisions and move it in a different direction, as did my friend, and that's about courage and leadership, so that's a big part of what I do as well.

Speaker 2: 35:16

I do have a newsletter that I put out weekly, so which, um be you know, um would love for people to subscribe if they'd like to. I cover a whole range of topics, um, just related to life and leadership, um, and anything that's out there that I just want to share with people. Uh, I'm also on um, facebook and Instagram and LinkedIn, so, um, people can reach out to me that way. Uh, and I also shared a link with you as well, jessica, because I think one of the most important things that we can do when we're supporting people is to actually just be to listen, and often that's what people need a lot of is just to feel, to just know that they've been heard, because listening is something that can do so much know that they've been heard, because listening is the thing that can do so much.

Speaker 1: 36:08

Yes, I agree with you a hundred percent. This has been such an insightful conversation. I love how you differentiated between a therapist and a coach, where a therapist is generally looking at the past and a coach is actually focusing on the present and moving forward. You know so you've brought so much. I encourage listeners to head over to the show notes to pick out your free resource with listening. Like it's such a good tool. That is so like we think, oh well, we're waiting to talk right, and so when we listen, we really gain a lot of valuable information about who's talking and how we can better serve them. So thank you so much for sharing your personal story with us today. I really enjoyed having you on.

Speaker 2: 36:47

Well, thank you so much for the opportunity to be here, Jessica, and share that with your listeners. I really appreciate it.

Speaker 1: 37:02

Thank you for tuning into the Sober Living Stories podcast. If you have been inspired, consider subscribing and sharing with anyone who could use hope in their lives. Remember to stay tuned for more inspiring stories in the episodes to come. To view our featured author of the month or to become a guest yourself, visit wwwjessicastephanoviccom.